ANALOGY TIEM

VULGAR : Wtd. :: UROBOROS : Dum Spiro Spero
ಠ_________ಠ

Unrelatedly, happy birthday Aldy.

Third time does the trick...?

(1:25:32 PM) Jarek: well
(1:25:41 PM) Jarek: i see the cars for the people inside
(1:25:53 PM) Jarek: who are all douchebags/old/too slow/dont deserve that fancy car
(1:26:15 PM) Jarek: not 'that volvo'
(1:26:32 PM) yuuzora: You don't see the driver in the car in front of you, though.
(1:27:27 PM) yuuzora: Do you seriously think of it as "the unknown douchebag" rather than "that car in front"?
(1:27:40 PM) Jarek: its unknown till i blow past him and look to see who it is
(1:27:45 PM) yuuzora: Exactly.
(1:28:00 PM) yuuzora: Until then, it's the car in front of you.
(1:28:12 PM) Jarek: its more like a faceless figure who is a dick
(1:28:45 PM) Jarek: with my eyes, i see the car
(1:28:53 PM) Jarek: in my mind, i feel hate towards the driver
(1:28:59 PM) Jarek: i cannot hate a car
(1:29:01 PM) yuuzora: Exactly.
(1:29:02 PM) Jarek: that would be silly
(1:29:08 PM) yuuzora: That is where the analogy fails.
(1:29:17 PM) yuuzora: We are AWARE the car has a driver.
(1:29:27 PM) yuuzora: That's why it's possible to not fall for the car.
(1:29:52 PM) yuuzora: With your eyes, for all intents and purposes, all you see is the car.
(1:29:59 PM) yuuzora: To others, all they see of you is a Golf.
(1:30:03 PM) yuuzora: Nothing changes that.
(1:30:20 PM) yuuzora: Does that mean you look like a Golf?
(1:30:26 PM) yuuzora: Even if that's what everyone else sees?
(1:31:22 PM) yuuzora: Everyone, including myself (unfortunately enough) only sees me in the body of this Asian chick.
(1:31:37 PM) Jarek: mmm
(1:31:51 PM) yuuzora: Does that mean I absolutely have to be this Asian chick?
(1:32:16 PM) yuuzora: Does it mean that the inner driver inside this Asian chick has to be even physically tangible and locate-able?
(1:32:40 PM) yuuzora: I don't DENY that I'm an Asian chick, or that my car is a Volvo.
(1:33:00 PM) yuuzora: I'm not saying that I don't fit in well in this Asian chick, or this Volvo that I was born in.
(1:33:27 PM) yuuzora: Since it's the only vehicle I've ever known, of course it fits - simply because I've never known anything better or worse or different.
(1:33:53 PM) Jarek: what kind of vehicle would you switch to if you could
(1:34:15 PM) yuuzora: It doesn't matter if they're all vehicles.
(1:34:27 PM) yuuzora: I want to see what the world would look like to a driver.
(1:34:52 PM) yuuzora: One vehicle doesn't differ from another if it means I'll still be stuck in one.
(1:35:04 PM) yuuzora: What does it look like, free of a vehicle?
(1:35:17 PM) yuuzora: I'm so very, very curious.
(1:35:23 PM) yuuzora: And another question I posed.
(1:35:43 PM) yuuzora: Is it possible that we live in an environment where being free of a vehicle is impossible?
(1:35:57 PM) yuuzora: Like how a space suit is required to be in space?
(1:36:38 PM) Jarek: well
(1:36:42 PM) Jarek: in that respect
(1:36:50 PM) Jarek: you can still see the environment outside you
(1:36:54 PM) Jarek: even if you're stuck inside the vehicle
(1:37:07 PM) Jarek: being stuck inside the suit doesnt stop you from looking outside
(1:37:08 PM) yuuzora: Reality outside does not necessarily look the same at all as what we see from inside the vehicle. Tinted glass, etc.
(1:37:20 PM) yuuzora: What does that reality, free from a vehicle, even look like?
(1:37:21 PM) Jarek: i guess
(1:37:27 PM) yuuzora: It doesn't have to look like ANYTHING we see now.
(1:37:34 PM) Jarek: probly too much to handle for our primitive monkey brains
(1:37:59 PM) Jarek: there might be wavelengths bombarding us all the time that our eyes filter out
(1:38:00 PM) Jarek: actually
(1:38:02 PM) Jarek: there are
(1:38:12 PM) Jarek: there are infrared emissions from everything
(1:38:15 PM) Jarek: if we could see them
(1:38:19 PM) Jarek: we'd be practically blind
(1:38:30 PM) Jarek: black body IR, reflected IR
(1:38:34 PM) Jarek: and UV as well
(1:38:43 PM) yuuzora: Even those are part of the physical reality.
(1:38:44 PM) Jarek: if we could perceive the reflected UV from objects
(1:38:52 PM) Jarek: we couldnt see anything
(1:40:11 PM) yuuzora: Even if we can't see them, our car brains have developed instruments that can.
(1:40:19 PM) yuuzora: We're very advanced cars who think we're just cars.
(1:40:28 PM) yuuzora: We have science that tell us more and more about how cars work every day.
(1:40:44 PM) yuuzora: We have other car machines that measures the world that a car lives in.
(1:40:57 PM) yuuzora: We know about things that our immediate car bodies cannot detect.
(1:41:07 PM) yuuzora: Like other EM waves.
(1:41:29 PM) yuuzora: Can a driver outside a car see those things?
(1:41:32 PM) yuuzora: Maybe, maybe not.
(1:41:47 PM) yuuzora: It's just as likely to not resemble what we cars see in the first place.
(1:42:18 PM) yuuzora: Maybe to drivers...
(1:42:24 PM) yuuzora: The possibilities are endless.
(1:43:18 PM) yuuzora: Maybe we'd see life forces or whatever.
(1:43:24 PM) yuuzora: Who knows.
(1:43:51 PM) Jarek: *shrug
(1:45:33 PM) Jarek: so how do we perceive something which has no measurable impact on the things we can perceive?
(1:45:51 PM) yuuzora: We can't.
(1:46:05 PM) yuuzora: And that's why most people are satisfied believing their lives prescribed as humans.
(1:46:20 PM) yuuzora: We take whatever we see as absolute, physical reality.
(1:46:34 PM) yuuzora: Anyone who says otherwise is labeled a lunatic.
(1:46:43 PM) yuuzora: Or a crazy religious leader.
(1:47:03 PM) yuuzora: I'll summarize Plato's Cave to you.
(1:47:10 PM) Jarek: ive read platos cave
(1:47:17 PM) yuuzora: Basically, Plato's cave was the inspiration for the Matrix and stuff.
(1:47:30 PM) yuuzora: Personally, I think the Matrix's interpretation is way too shallow.
(1:47:42 PM) yuuzora: Outside of the matrix is only another physical reality.
(1:47:53 PM) yuuzora: Wow, sucker.
(1:47:59 PM) yuuzora: Not creative enough.
(1:48:21 PM) yuuzora: If you've read, you should know.
(1:48:44 PM) yuuzora: Since all we've known are shadows projected on a wall, it's impossible for us to gain understanding of what the world outside looks like.
(1:49:09 PM) yuuzora: From what we hear of the few people who have run outside the cave and have seen, we think it's absolutely ridiculous.
(1:49:30 PM) yuuzora: But at the same time, if someone lies and says they've gone out but really hasn't, and just makes up some crazy tale that they have gone out...
(1:49:35 PM) yuuzora: We wouldn't know the difference if he's lying.
(1:49:39 PM) Jarek: so by becoming more technologically advanced, can we prove that these outsides exist?
(1:49:53 PM) yuuzora: Maybe.
(1:49:57 PM) yuuzora: Maybe not.
(1:50:09 PM) yuuzora: I always thought the forefront of physics is where things might point.
(1:50:30 PM) yuuzora: Crazy shit that we don't understand like wormholes and blackholes and other modern physics crap.
(1:50:50 PM) yuuzora: Maybe that is only a corner of what the world looks like to a driver.
(1:51:12 PM) Jarek: so why dont you go into physics
(1:51:21 PM) Jarek: it sounds like you're passionate for it
(1:52:32 PM) yuuzora: I just said. It may, or it may not be.
(1:53:06 PM) yuuzora: If true reality is entirely different from our physical reality, exploring it through physical reality means will only get us farther from the truth.
(1:53:30 PM) yuuzora: I used to be fascinated by quantum physics, when I was like 12 and first learning English.
(1:53:49 PM) yuuzora: But then when we had that in Stuy junior year, it didn't seem at all like what I was hoping for.
(1:54:18 PM) yuuzora: I was expecting it to be philosophical for some reason, instead of having to memorize stuff about quarks and spins and photon packets.
(1:55:07 PM) yuuzora: I'm not passionate about physics. Quite far from it.
(1:55:23 PM) yuuzora: All I want to know is what I look like without this skin.
(1:55:39 PM) yuuzora: And what the world looks like behind the panorama.
(1:55:51 PM) yuuzora: And it's not immediately possible.
(1:56:02 PM) yuuzora: And sometimes I feel dead with that itching curiosity.
(1:56:24 PM) Jarek: mm...
(1:56:39 PM) yuuzora: I would say the difference between this mentality and going around accepting life like everyone else...
(1:57:01 PM) yuuzora: Is the difference between breathing consciously and breathing normally/subconsciously.
(1:58:15 PM) yuuzora: When I'm busy or stressed and feel the ties of responsibility strapping me down (like now, studying for the MCAT and such), I'm usually breathing subconsciously, not questioning that I'm Jing, worried about my future, etc.
(1:58:55 PM) yuuzora: But when I have lax times, or even at any time I want, I can induce controlled breathing, or to start looking out of my eyes like I'm in that moving tower I mention so often.
(1:59:21 PM) yuuzora: How exactly I go back to breathing subconsciously or becoming one with Jing again, I don't know.
(2:00:50 PM) Jarek: so help me make these vehicles last for much longer than theyre supposed to, so we have enough time to puzzle that out
(2:00:52 PM) Jarek: =]
(2:01:34 PM) yuuzora: That's just being shackled with limited view for even longer.
(2:01:48 PM) yuuzora: I don't seek death.
(2:01:52 PM) yuuzora: I don't fear death.
(2:02:09 PM) yuuzora: Maybe that's what it would take to become free of the vehicle.
(2:02:15 PM) yuuzora: Lots of religions suggest that.
(2:02:18 PM) yuuzora: But.
(2:02:39 PM) yuuzora: Since I'm in a vehicle now, might as well make the most of it, for the vehicle's sake.
(2:03:03 PM) Jarek: and for the sake of those around you
(2:03:08 PM) Jarek: present and future =]